find the cost of freedom
buried in the ground

An off-duty US Park Police officer unintentionally shot and killed another officer. HE DIDN'T THINK THE GUN WAS LOADED, police said

 Dragonfly_Launch wrote:

 Dragonfly_Launch wrote:

Better stated.

 kurtster wrote:

We blame the shooter and the easy, sometimes almost unfettered access to guns.

I own six weapons. Three pistols. And, no one, not a single person should be able to own an AR 15 for personal protection. Nor a rocket launcher, grenade launcher, full body armor or 20000 rounds of ammunition.

The system for background checks has been broken from the start. It should be a rapid access computerized and most importantly rapidly updateable. It is not. If you beat your wife so badly she goes into the hospital your name should appear in the database the day of your arrest. And within 24 hours the sheriff should come remove guns from your possession. Lying about what weapons you have should result in a 5 year jail sentence and lifetime gun ownership ban. 

The military, because we ask so much of these men and women, results in high rates of mental instability. It is a fact. Suicide and weapon crimes are far higher in those exposed to violence, war zones, dead children, a bloodied friend bleeding out in your arms. This particular shooter had past mental hospital stays. Red flag laws should be real everywhere. It is a touchy area but it needs to be sorted.

Generally the attitude of the right is: make no new gun laws. The Second amendment and its one sentence and one comma has never guaranteed everyone all the weapons they want under the guise of personal safety from this mad world.

We must admit that America is no longer safe as it stands. It should be a goal to make it safer. The world shakes its head at our sustained foolishness.

 kurtster wrote:
So many words, so little said. Thanks Captain Obvious.
 
So taking away one’s ability to own an assault weapon is taking away an essential freedom? You’re more f*cked up than even I thought if that truly is the parallel you are trying to draw between my last post and this one.
 
How about this… what if the Maine shooter only had access to a conventional hand-gun or knife? Would the level of devastation have been different? The obvious answer is yes. Now you will come back with something like: “Well he would have found a way to get one”… maybe. But if assault weapons were made illegal to own and illegal to purchase then putting up a hurdle as some measure of prevention is only common sense.

I don’t know how Hunter Biden factors into any of this but please keep shoe-horning his name into all of your replies… it’s very entertaining.

 steeler wrote: 
It is a useless fact.  It is akin to saying that you need alcohol to get drunk.

There is no unfettered access to guns in the United States.  Unless your name is Hunter Biden.

 kurtster wrote:
My statement speaks for itself. It is an undeniable fact.

The search for a solution has to include a recognition that unfettered access to guns, including AR-15s, is intrinsic to the problem.

 steeler wrote: 
Card was in the Army, actively as a firearms instructor.

So as richard posted earlier that up to 31% of mass shooters were in the military, we should get rid of the military ?  We get rid of all guns, in private possession, law enforcement and military?  Is that your solution ?

Sounds like it based upon your comment above.  You blame the gun, not the shooter.

 kurtster wrote:
An unassailable fact: if he did not have a gun, this would not have happened, at least not to the degree it did.

 VV wrote: 
 The best thing that one can do is try and live life to the fullest. Be nice to strangers and friends.  Do unto others like you would have them do unto you.  Live every day like it could be your last.

It can be over in the blink of an eye through no fault of your own.  Kinda like those who had a bad Saturday in Israel. Or a bad night in Lewiston, Maine.

Or you can cower in fear, curled up in the fetal position in a corner drooling, waiting for the end, blaming others for your own problems.

You want a fool proof safe life.  It doesn't work that way.  For anybody.  And all the laws in the world cannot make it that way.

A drunk driver can go left of center and hit you head on.  There are laws about drinking and driving.  Are they going to stop that driver from killing you ?

There are things beyond anyone's control.  Something is always going to go wrong.  Maybe not today or tomorrow. But it will happen.

Being in the wrong place at the wrong time is all it takes sometimes.  There are no laws that can prevent that, yet you seek them out and want to impose them on others because of your own fears.

"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety"  Franklin.

And another timely thing he said ...

"Whoever would overthrow the Liberty of a Nation, must begin by subduing the Freeness of Speech", but that quote belongs in the Biden or Democrat party thread for another day.

 kurtster wrote:
Predictable. I knew you didn’t have a suggestion to offer but you could have just said so in a few less sentences. Let’s just let the killings continue and bitch about everything.
 
No regular citizen should ever own an assault rifle… period.

 VV wrote: 
Passing more laws that never get enforced nor are intended to be enforced is the same as doing nothing.  Hunter is the poster child for more guns laws.

How about actual consequences for bad behaviour ?  Criminals, when arrested, are out in the street within hours.  No cash bail.  And then the prosecutors drop the charges, because the criminals are the victims.  They have more rights than the actual victims.  

Who again wants to defund the police ?  Ain't my side of the aisle.  Well they sure did a great job, didn't they ?  The system is totally broken.

 Steely_D wrote:
Yes, comforting.

 VV wrote:
Well, “thoughts and prayers.“  That’s doing something. 

 kurtster wrote:
Your "do nothing" approach is inspirational! 
 
So yeah, let's all continue to do nothing and hope mass shootings just magically stop. That'll fix things?

 steeler wrote: 
It has a "yellow flag" law.  The system failed.

Oh, and Hunter.  Selective enforcement.  The laws don't work.

 kurtster wrote:
Maine does not have a “red-flag” law.

 kurtster wrote:
Dude...you talk in circles.

It's a mental health issue... gun laws for people with mental health issues don't work... it's not a gun issue.

The number of mass shootings went down when we had a weapons assault ban, and has skyrocketed since it expired.

Appreciating that mental health is the problem...and it's growing...and laws don't work...what do you suggest we do?  Learn to live with it (if we're lucky that is)?

Sooner or later this discussion will come around to Constitutional rights.  How can you support a candidate who has violated it, called for its termination, and this month told a judge it's not his job (as President) to support it?


FWIW - you're more likely to die in states where there are lax gun laws (MS, AL, etc.) than you are in Chicago.